Imho Jomo is too 'inspired' to be worn comfortably by myself.

The other reason I brought this up...

Imho there is a difference between recreating something from RL (which obviously HAS to be selfmade then in maya/Blender) and making 1 to 1 replicas of items from games, which could as well be ripped.

Ahh..jomo. The place notorious for directly ripping skin stores in the early days, ripping straight from various games and sneakily 'frankensteining' parts of game rips into 1 new item.

The question I had about those Tera pants is, I couldn't tell either. Were they recreated? If they're recreated and the Trompe bed is recreated, are they both okay?

I'm not just stirring the pot here, this is an issue we're going to be seeing a LOT as the grid gets smaller, so I think a healthy conversation is in order. I look forward to everyone's thoughts, so -

-please share this plurk and discuss!

Imho, the Trompe bed is more okay than the Jomo Pants. I am personally pretty sure they have been straightly ripped (like most other items there) from games. ReiTuki pointed some of them out a while ago.

As long as the beddesign isn't copyrighted (I doubt it can be?!) Cory didn't do anything legally wrong. Jomo however, did.

aemeth: Recreating things in SL and selling them isn't okay- technically, but the court battle to try and prove a design vs a recreation into a different medium is extremely difficult.

Found it. Imho, that is the same mesh with a different texture and added parts?

Even if it wasn't, it is way too close of a re-creation to be comfortable with for me.

TheBloggingElf: There's no if, it pretty much is. One of the obvious ones was this: https://slm-assets1.seco...
when they decided to take on a more popular, and easier to spot game.

Also their history of ripping and frankensteining skins supports the fact that they have always been nothing but hacks. They do not have a positive history as a designer. They just alter it enough

for it to be very difficult to fight in court. This happens all the time in regards to IRL businesses. IT's terrible, but there are loopholes there that people can get away with (like turning pikachu green)

Contraption: Yeah I admittedly haven't paid them any attention anymore, never saw the military gear. ;O Though honestly the worst offenders ever are probably Manticore and Legend Darkrose.

Contraption: So basically they alter it and hope people don't bother trying it in court? Grandiose. -.-

TheBloggingElf: Yep! As for stores like manticore, I call those 'lazy' rippers. Where they barely do much except like, just adjust it for SL. Those are the easiest to spot.

Pretty much what Jomo's doing is akin to this: youthoughtwewouldntnotic... <--- and people tend to get away with it.

BTW, that blog I've linked may be about illustrations, but there are a lot of aspects in it that make you realize just how difficult it is to have a firm grasp on protecting designs and artwork, and how

even big wigs can get away with it. It can relate to SL, imo.

i won't touch anything by jomo with a 10 foot pole

another "original" work:

pic won't show up, link is here if you scroll down a bit: Mesh Avatars Currently On The Market - Page 37 - SLUniverse Forum...

no modifications on the boots or the chest armor. that's not "inspired by" or "modded enough that it shouldn't count"

So what should I do with the body? Can anyone recognize it from a game? If it's a rip then Jomo shouldn't get away with it.

aemeth: Unfortunately, it's very difficult to tell if a body is ripped from a game since, the human body tends to look similar -- and as a previous 'skin creator', they modded the texture.

aemeth: There is a vey high chance they took from an open source site such as Makehuman or various 'human body' downloads, making it even more difficult to pin.

Honestly, I wouldn#t wear it for the sole reason to not promote that store any further and not givign them any exposure. Even if this is a non ripped item, their store is just super fishy.

Unless they truly retsarted their brand and kicked all the fishy stuff from it? And would basically start over with legal items only? No way I'd support them with my money or by wearing their stuff.

Not enough knowledge is how this situation happened though, shouldn't people speak up?

aemeth: People have been speaking up, but few actually listen, and many are without knowledge. It's why ripped mesh runs rampant and we still see Manticore get blogged.

Most people don#t care. "I cannot find another cat so I will take the Manticore cat" I have spoken up everywhere and loudly so, especially about Manticore.

It is actualyl why I started We <3 RP originally. I got upset that Manticore etc made so much money while original creators took the backseat. So I excluded them and tried to promote legal stores only.

I'm so mad, I'm leaving this dude a one-star review to warn others.

I didn't know Slink was making a body!

Wtf? I can't even review it? Marketplace won't let me!

Left a review on the demo, best I can do :/

aemeth: ...Wait. Is that review for the Slink body? Because if you're saying the Slink body was stolen...I'd like to talk with you about it.

The slink body isn't even out yet lol

The review is for Jomo's body that I got ripped off on

I mean I was mad because after I blogged about this, I saw Slink's preview. I would have waited but I gave up hope in waiting for ANY men's body that wasn't expensive

aemeth: Ahhh. You'd just linked to an image of the Slink body while saying "I'm so mad, I'm leaving this dude a one-star review to warn others." So I was confused.

I mean, I know Siddean's not a dude and the body isn't out yet, but...nipping that in the bud

Yeah I've known she's a woman for a while lol

Why did you show the slink body and say you are leaving a bad review because you think it might be stolen?

CajsaLilliehook: That was my point! Thank you. Hence my confusion!

Why would I misgender anyone when I'm genderfluid myself?

...what

I would never misgender Siddean. I was not talking about her.

aemeth, you don't seem to understand what we're talking about here.

I get what you mean but I clearly wasn't referring to her, in context of the conversation. I even explained.

But yeah, I'm genderfluid and I don't go around misgendering people

Maybe it would cause less confusion to those reading along later on if you deleted the comment. We're not talking about misgendering people.

We're talking about you showing a picture of Siddean's work and characterizing it as stolen. That is problematic, completely regardless of the word "dude."

Not wanting to stir the pot here, since Makehuman was mentioned... This is their license: MakeHuman | Open source tool for making 3d characters - You can use the exports in SL without restrictions.

MakeHuman | Open source tool for making 3d characters

Thanks for helping us get back on track, Auryn

Not sarcastic--really. I was disheartened enough I got ripped off for so much that I actually saved for

i don't need additional bullshit on top of that

Like I immediately said afterwards "I didn't even know Slink was making a body"

Okay. So linking the picture with the above comment was just a simple error? Cool.

Yeah, no go make some drama plurk about it, I guess

I don't care. Just go far away from here. I'm really not in the mood for you jumping in like that right now

aemeth I think you are missing their point Aemeth, their issue was you put a picture of slinks body with the comment you are so mad you are leaving this dude a one star review.

which can onl mean THIS as in the picture next to the comment, that was all, just trying to avoid those people that skim and suddenly think you mean Slink ripped something, & I understand you also know isn't

the case from the rest of your comments

I know they skimmed, that's why I'm really annoyed lol

Thankfully Slink's body will be less money to save so I can be ready by the time it's released

aemeth, that is not what I said, they are trying to avoid those that WILL skim, your pic of slink and the comment right beside it can potentially damage Siddeans product, that is what they were trying to avoid

No, I did not skim. I read everything and then saw your slink post (before the one right after) and got confused that you were adding it to your list.

Okay. So let's get angry at Jomo because that's the real problem here

The conversation is also about, is that body a rip, and what should I do about it?

The secondary issue is that you should delete that one line with the picture of the slink male physique and the comment that you are leaving that dude a bad review, etc.

Continuing to leave it there when three people have expressed the way it causes confusion seems like choosing to shed heat instead of light.

Y'all need to leave this alone and move on, or I'm going to start blocking people for attacking me over some misunderstanding that was already explained. I'm not going to give any further warnings on this issue

Stop now.

That's fine, Let me take care of that for you.

Cool seeya

You beat me to it.

Take yourself somewhere else, either learn what a misunderstanding is or go away

And Sasy too, for attacking me on Skype about this, when I told her to knock it off already

This is harassment and it's just really going too far.

And while I'm at it, pressing someone outside of SL to do something you want and then resorting to cursing when you don't get your way is really fucking pathetic and abusive

Even in SL it's pathetic but.. anyway that's REALLY just beyond what's even necessary. And still not enough anger over what caused this thread in the first place.

Jomo rips?

If anyone wants me to edit anything in this plurk, they'll need to send an n/c asking NICELY, and send the notecard to Aemeth Lysette. I don't respond to harassment and bullying.

Also if it's the three guilty people who all had a hand in me being harassed today, they need to include an apology.

AurynBeorn: I'm not saying makehuman is bad, but what I am saying is that there's an extremely high chance that none of their things are made from scratch. Due to both history and recent releases.

AurynBeorn: Even if they pulled it out of make human (this is only a possible option, I need to see the wireframe to compare the topology) I do no think it is a good idea to encourage a store

AurynBeorn: that for years, is, and has been ripping off both SL artists and rl 3D artists both. Not saying it's the body, but it's the fact that they always take shortcuts to make some dosh.

AurynBeorn: --and have been getting away with way before 2009. (Especially copybooting skins- that was their main thing back in the day) - they got away with it because they take the loophole route.

[Sorchiee] I'm really sick of peopl...

I'm not saying that what this creator does is right or wrong. If they're doing wrong, which I don't know, then that's it. It's wrong.

I'm saying that mentioning Makehuman as a source for human body meshes isn't fair, for the license allows it.

If we're going to be so elitist as to demand that we create all ourselves, then I demand we code our own operating systems, compilers and 3D and graphic tools.

If that seems excessive, then we have to admit that using tools whose license allow exporting and using their models even commercially is legal and is right.

AurynBeorn: I'm not stating that the body is makehuman, and I am not saying makehuman is bad, I'm just mentioning that their body is likely from a source. Make human is the easiest one

AurynBeorn: There is no need to call me 'elitist' about it. I'm merely stating that they have drawn it from a source too vague for us to identify for a rip.

So what if it is? Make human allows it in their license. Why bring it up?

AurynBeorn: ^^ Above statement. They have drawn it from a source too vague for us for a rip, and it may be - as I will quote directly from my post that mentioned it 'from an open source like make human'

I haven't called anyone in particular anything and I'm not going down that road.

I'm explaining why it's unfair bringing up Makehuman as a source of something shady - which might have not been said in those words, but it reads implicitly.

If someone uses an opensource generator whose license allows for that use, it is right and there's no point in bringing it up.

AurynBeorn: I apologize if there is a misunderstanding in context to my statement in Makehuman. Again, I DID not say make human is bad, I was telling Cake that they likely drew from a source and thus,

We cannot identify the mesh the body's from, and if Jomo was smart they'd take it from makehuman, and thus the mesh would be legal.

I repeat again, I did not say make human is bad, I only stated the possibility of where they drew source for the body. This is NOT bad - but i'm just saying that the body must have come from somewhere.

So if there are legal sources and it's a possibility and we don't know for sure... Do I need to write the question?

I like innocent until proven guilty, not the other way around.

AurynBeorn: The proof is in all of the skin copybots they have done in the past, the mesh rips from resident evil, tera, dynasty warriors and more. They never had a moment where they designed

and made something- The fact that they have been violating original works has been for...a long time. They have always had a bad name in the market, it's why you don't often see them in events.

Again, I don't know about that. But if all that is true, and Makehuman is brought to the mix, some people reading this are going to read "oh noes, Makehuman is bad too".

I'm not saying I don't believe the charges. I say, let's not bring a legal source of mesh models to the mix of shady practices.

AurynBeorn: I apologize if that has what made some people assume. I stated it was a possibility of where they got the mesh from and why we can't say specifically that body of theirs is illegal because

the concept is far more vague than say, a costume from a game.

One of the hardest things is to identify whether or not a 3D model of the human body is a rip, because there are multiple open source models for everyone to use, which are legal. if that helps clear things up.

Sadly, that's what may happen. We have problems enough with legit rippers (if you excuse me the awful pun), as to make people think that legit sources aren't legit. That's all my gripe

AurynBeorn: Yes, I can see why it can be misunderstood when the conversation is not instilled in other's minds. I apologize and clarify further that I was simply noting

why it is difficult to report a human mesh body as 'ripped'.

In that I agree

I know I may sound like justifying some people. I'm not. I don't know how to explain... It's so easy jumping to conclusions because "someone read something quickly on the Internet", (...)

that I think we have to be careful of what we say and how about the possible sources and what that implies. It takes one misunderstanding to spread false information.

This guy rips? Then it has to be known. Just, let's not mix legit sources if we're unsure

As for jomo ripping, you can google it up - people have been singing songs about their legendary loophole dodging for yearsss - and I mean years. It's crazy how far they can go.

We can make a campfire right now and I'll tell you the legend of how Jomo dodges the law like placing green pikachus with oddly shaped eyes on pencil cases.

lol

Ugh - Okay, that is not right >.<

you can google "jomo rips" and there's plenty of it right there for all to see. people calling them out on flickr, and sluniverse with comparison shots to videogames and everything.